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vanitashazeI'm working my way through season one of Supernatural - I've said it before and I'll say it again, I fucking love my little small-town library's dvd collection - and I'm mostly satisfied. However, I'll admit it: while some episodes are really cool, others are not so great. Not that bad writing is uncommon for television shows, but for some reason, it's really getting to me here. Maybe because almost all of the bad episodes - "Route 666", "The Benders", that one with the shapeshifter - had the potential to be really cool with only a few slight adjustments. The potential for those connections was there. For example, "Route 666". As it stands, it was sort of about Dean's thwarted love life, and some really awkward commentary on racism - apparently that while it existed in the past, it's all gone now, or something? - and featured a sort-of-interesting-but-not-really Cassie, who was supposed to be tough and shit and instead was - not. The plot didn't really hook up, the reveal was forced, the end was unsatisfying, etc. But it could have been a tragedy, guys. It could have been about keeping secrets - the town's past, Dean's hunting, Dean's relationship with Cassie, Cassie's parents' relationship, Cyrus' activities and death - and how they never stay buried, how they get forced under and then become something huge and dark and terrifying. The invisible monster truck in the middle of the room*. They could have drawn parallels between Cassie and Dean's romance, and the romance between Cassie's parents. Both were couples with the odds pretty much all against them, after all, and when Cassie and Dean separated at the end, sure that it would never work, it would have been all the more poignant - and uncertain - for the reminder that, despite it all, Cassie's parents did make it. Like, Dean's comment about how he's seen "stranger things"? I think a better comeback would have been, "well, your parents did it." And that's only the tip of the iceberg, guys. That episode could have been the emotional high point of the season.
Or "The Benders", which is really all about family, but not quite the way I think it should be. When I first saw that creepy little girl - Missy - I thought, wow, this is a kid who's been raised in a seriously weird environment, to a very twisted definition of "normal". And yet, this is what she's been taught is right, this is normal for her, and her brothers. Which is exactly like Sam and Dean with hunting. They're all working with operative definitions of "normal"; they're all doing what they do, essentially, because their parents told them to. And that "hunt" thing, man. If they had paralleled that somehow - maybe cut between the Winchesters' and the Benders' pre-hunt rituals, had them repeat some of the language (that "you hurt my brother, I'll kill you"; "you hurt my family, I'll bleed you" thing, though it would have been much eerier if they had said the same thing). Not to mention, this season is all about John Winchester's absence.
So, my ideal "Benders"? John Winchester is missing and Pa Bender is dead. The Benders are hunting the Winchesters, thinking that they're typical prey, and the Winchesters are hunting the Benders, thinking that they're on a monster hunt. The awesome female cop** would have been there as a foil to the Winchesters - to emphasize what they do is not "normal", constantly checking them, providing the much-needed, "What?" - but in the end she wouldn't have been so normal after all, because she's much more obsessive about her missing brother. Maybe there's a bulletin board behind her desk similar to John's hotel room collages, or at her apartment. (Dean sees it, lifts an eyebrow, and she says, "Well. You know.") They cut between the Winchester pre-hunting rituals, and the Benders' (gun loading / knife sharpening, putting on jackets / putting on camo, etc.). All three groups of siblings use the same phrases. Maybe the Bender brothers tease each other a little bit, and they protect their little sister. There are two empty father-sized spaces. And when the Winchesters ask the Benders why they do this, they say, "Because Pa told us to."
Don't you think that would be an improvement? I think that would be an improvement.
*Comparable to the elephant.
**Who, by the way, would retain her rigid cop bun - but have hanks of it pulled out as her emotional / physical state roughens - and would not wear a skintight white t-shirt. Or, you know, have to have Sam save her. And she would totally say at the end, "Good luck, Dean", or something, because there's no way she hasn't figured who he really is out by the end of the episode.
Or "The Benders", which is really all about family, but not quite the way I think it should be. When I first saw that creepy little girl - Missy - I thought, wow, this is a kid who's been raised in a seriously weird environment, to a very twisted definition of "normal". And yet, this is what she's been taught is right, this is normal for her, and her brothers. Which is exactly like Sam and Dean with hunting. They're all working with operative definitions of "normal"; they're all doing what they do, essentially, because their parents told them to. And that "hunt" thing, man. If they had paralleled that somehow - maybe cut between the Winchesters' and the Benders' pre-hunt rituals, had them repeat some of the language (that "you hurt my brother, I'll kill you"; "you hurt my family, I'll bleed you" thing, though it would have been much eerier if they had said the same thing). Not to mention, this season is all about John Winchester's absence.
So, my ideal "Benders"? John Winchester is missing and Pa Bender is dead. The Benders are hunting the Winchesters, thinking that they're typical prey, and the Winchesters are hunting the Benders, thinking that they're on a monster hunt. The awesome female cop** would have been there as a foil to the Winchesters - to emphasize what they do is not "normal", constantly checking them, providing the much-needed, "What?" - but in the end she wouldn't have been so normal after all, because she's much more obsessive about her missing brother. Maybe there's a bulletin board behind her desk similar to John's hotel room collages, or at her apartment. (Dean sees it, lifts an eyebrow, and she says, "Well. You know.") They cut between the Winchester pre-hunting rituals, and the Benders' (gun loading / knife sharpening, putting on jackets / putting on camo, etc.). All three groups of siblings use the same phrases. Maybe the Bender brothers tease each other a little bit, and they protect their little sister. There are two empty father-sized spaces. And when the Winchesters ask the Benders why they do this, they say, "Because Pa told us to."
Don't you think that would be an improvement? I think that would be an improvement.
*Comparable to the elephant.
**Who, by the way, would retain her rigid cop bun - but have hanks of it pulled out as her emotional / physical state roughens - and would not wear a skintight white t-shirt. Or, you know, have to have Sam save her. And she would totally say at the end, "Good luck, Dean", or something, because there's no way she hasn't figured who he really is out by the end of the episode.
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Date: 2009-12-21 01:45 pm (UTC)I thought the Benders was one of the most powerful episodes of the first season, exactly because it was about the weird shit humans can get up to.. and it really throws Dean's cynicism into relief.
(It was also the impetus for my vewy first wincest fic, but that's neither here nor there.)
damn, I need a Dean icon
Date: 2009-12-22 06:15 am (UTC)I'm not sure if I would agree with you about the "most powerful of the first season" bit - that, I think, I'll give to "Faith" (!), "Nightmare", and "Hell House", though admittedly I haven't gotten past the last one yet - but I do agree that the "weird shit humans get up to" theme was great, and I loved how the bit about how Dean understands monsters, but not humans. Not to mention, it was a great follow-up to the previous episode, as that was the one that Dean promised that as long as he was around, nothing would hurt Sam. And immediately, this is called to test - not even as a casualty of the weirdo life they lead, but by people. Anyways - all of this was cool, and I just wish they had done more of that, along with more about the awesome cop. As it stands, I feel the episode was about 80% CRAZY-ASS REDNECKS! and 20% previously mentioned cool. Way too focused on Billy-Bob Joe, man.
As far as the plot arcs go - maybe it's that I tend to watch the episodes in quick sequence (I'll pick up the DVDs of whatever new show I like - because I'm never lucky enough to get into a fandom in its infancy, oh no - and kind of rush 'em), but I like the plot arcs much better than the episodic things, because they feel so slow. But, yeah. We do sort of need a break, especially in the fifth season. I just wish the break hadn't been the one about the RPGers and the creepy dead kids, because if one thing freaks me out to high hell, it's creepy dead kids. I could only bring myself to watch parts of it, so I'm still kind of - unsatisfied. (And yeah, I know. I'm easily freaked out, hate horror movies, and my new fandom is Supernatural. My irony, let me show you it!)
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Date: 2009-12-21 05:06 pm (UTC)this post brought to you by barefoot zinfandel (so posh! erk.)
Date: 2009-12-22 06:01 am (UTC)LJ stinks at OpenID; I must have tried posting these comments four times before I gave up
Date: 2009-12-28 09:22 am (UTC)'Low Red Moon.' (http://www.thuviaptarth.net/vids/index.html) Ruby, S3. And the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood. After 'Women's Work,' this is probably my favorite SPN video. Fabulously gorgeous, powerful with a real menace and threat the show didn't capitalize on in either its prevalent visuals or its dialogue. I've loved Tanya Donelly for years and her voice is a perfect match for this video. As a bonus, I've found it's optimized for viewing on a Mac; I recommend the big download if you have the space, because, well, gorgeous. You can leave any comments at this post (http://thuviaptarth.dreamwidth.org/107790.html). (The streaming and download links are broken there, so don't try them.) The vidder talks about it a little more here (http://thuviaptarth.dreamwidth.org/121021.html?replyto=1212605&style=light):
Basically, vidding Ruby made me more aware than ever of how much the SPN writers' prejudices and preconceptions interfere with their storytelling. S3 Ruby is supposed to be a powerful and dangerous figure -- not always powerful enough to get out of trouble, and I love how (skip S3 and S4 spoilers (#skip.S3S4spoilers)) she takes off in "Jus in Bello" and then later in S4 when the angels show up. () Or at least the dialogue tells us she's supposed to be powerful and dangerous, because there are damn few visuals of it, and when they exist, they are often undercutting her strength.
(skip S3 spoilers (#skip.S3spoilers)) The only times we see her fighting in Season 3 are "The Magnificent Seven," "Malleus Maleficarum," and "No Rest for the Wicked" -- and the only time we see her win a fight is in "The Magnificent Seven." In MM, Dean kills Ruby's nemesis; in "No Rest for the Wicked," Ruby kicks the Winchesters' asses and -- loses the fight. There are very few power shots of Ruby, and when they exist, they are often staged poorly -- the car slowing down to approach her in MM, for example, where the menace of her presence is undercut by her shifting stance. ()
Comments, part 2 of 3
Date: 2009-12-28 09:27 am (UTC)'Madonna.' (http://sweetestdrain.livejournal.com/209349.html?mode=reply&style=mine) Let me underneath your halo.
Supernatural is Mary's nightmare, take one: S1-S2. Claustrophobic, lovely, painfully sad. Pretty much sadder every time I watch it, in fact. Cocorosie is fantastically well suited to the video's delicate and eerie atmosphere.
'And all my bones began to shake.' (http://community.livejournal.com/lightningmix/3004.html?format=light) DEAN: "You're so damaged." BELA: "Takes one to know one." Felt it in my fist, in my feet, in the hollows of my eyelids. Bela as Dean's mirror in S3, but with heartbreaking differences. Beautiful editing; Florence's larger-than-life voice makes it feel still more epic despite the short length of the video.
'Fade Out' is at the same post - it's about Castiel, Jimmy, and Claire. There's darkness at the end of the tunnel. Wonder, terror, and human love as trapped by vast and largely uncaring forces beyond comprehension. I was surprised at how well the choice of music worked with the video's themes; the end prior to the last soundbite is especially remarkable.
'The Devil's Inside My Head.' (http://mithborien.livejournal.com/90736.html?mode=reply&style=mine) "You know what's the worst thing I can think of?"
Comments, part 3 of 3
Date: 2009-12-28 09:37 am (UTC)'Surrendered Flags.' (http://moodfic.livejournal.com/128542.html?style=mine) They do not sleep nights but stand between rows of glowing corn and cabbages. 563 words. Packs a lot into a visceral turn of phrase. Tamara was supposed to be a recurring character, but she's never come back so far since her one appearance in 3.01. I wish she had, especially after reading this. Epigraph from Erin Belieu.
'Lamp Black Eyes.' (http://moodfic.livejournal.com/128542.html?style=mine) Instruments of mercy are foreign to their hands. 259 words. Palpable, poignant details you can practically taste. Jo & Ellen, pre-series. Epigraph from Jeffrey Foucault.
'What Gets Said.' (http://moodfic.livejournal.com/157769.html?style=mine) The gods don't listen to reason. 658 words. One thing that could have happened to Bela after 3.15. The surprise guest is just right. If I say any more it'll be spoilers, but the end scenario's about what you'd expect for something with a Margaret Atwood epigraph.
'Woman Inflammable.' (http://vee-fic.livejournal.com/55769.html?format=light) It hadn't occurred to him to carry a handgun in the process of buying chips. She knew better, apparently: drug dealer, or gangster, or maybe this was an even worse neighborhood than he thought. It was weird: she didn't look particularly jumpy or scared, just politely getting out of the way while he stood dumb in front of the candy machine. 4585 words. My favorite of this bunch by far. I'm in love with the author's use of limited POV, matter-of-fact prose, and how of-course-believable - but no less poignant, horrifying, and wrenchingly sad - it makes the calamitous and extraordinary. Author's notes as follows...
Fandom: Supernatural / Sarah Connor Chronicles crossover
Rating: PG-13 for gross imagery
Spoilers: none.
What Is It: A meeting; a misunderstanding; a mission.
Tagline: John Winchester was getting the hang of this paranoia thing.
Whoops, wrong link
Date: 2009-12-28 10:05 am (UTC)Just remembered this one, re: Kathleen and Cassie
Date: 2010-01-03 10:11 am (UTC)Summary: Kathleen Hudak is a survivor, even when she isn't sure of anything else. Short. Special Agent Victor Henriksen asks Kathleen Hudak to help with the FBI's pursuit of the Winchesters by re-interviewing survivors. Along the way, she has two conversations with Cassie Robinson. I really enjoy the measured prose, the distinct and vivid character voices, and Kathleen's narrative POV; she's every inch a cop here.
Excerpt: Kathleen is starting to suspect that they aren't afraid, not of the Winchesters. They're like her, and this girl Charlie: complicit. They're both guilty of something. That's Dean's talent, the way he implicates his victims in whatever it is he does.
Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essays.
Date: 2010-01-03 08:05 pm (UTC)Yeah, SPN and subtlety? Not exactly common bedfellows.
Though I loved "Fade Out", I think my favorite of all of your vid recs - thank you for those, by the way! I love well-done vids, they're such an effective vehicle for those elusive emotional connections that, while perfectly legitimate, are harder to pin down in fics and thus would otherwise be only objectively known - was "The Devil's Inside My Head". I love Mary, and this vid was so gorgeous. To be honest, I'm not sure if I liked "Low Red Moon". It's visually stunning, but it didn't click (maybe the tempo? the song/source didn't feel like it matched up at times). At the same time, it didn't allow itself to be dismissed, either, so it's sitting in my FANVIDS folder, kind of staring up balefully at me. I suspect I shall just have to let it percolate for a while, and revisit it later.
However, what the vidder said clicked PERFECTLY, because yes, something had been bothering me about the female villains / women with power in this show, and she put her finger right on it. Not just the whole "we're told they have power / are dangerous, but never see it" thing with Ruby, but the body language/voice! I think a large part of what was bothering me was the physical acting, because while we do get these scary/powerful women - the crossroads demon, Ruby, Bella, Lillith - they mince! And shift! And have little girl voices (and in one case, the villain is actually a little girl)! The male demons on the show - the last Alistair, I think, was by far the creepiest, though Yellow Eyes is a close second - do the slinky & perversely sexual thing too, but they do so convincingly, whereas - due to cultural baggage or bad acting, probably a combination of both - Bela, Ruby, and older!Lillith just sound kind of, dare I say it, bitchy*. The only female villain who actually kind of worked for me was the first Meg Masters, because she got the creepy last!Alistair-esque thing down, and though sexual and violent, was also... detached enough from everything that it just hit all those subtle little buttons in your head that tell you, there is something WRONG with this person.
*I think this is why I liked Ruby 2.0 better. They didn't write her any better, but the actress gave her some character.
...Damn, I need more SPN icons.
Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-04 02:47 am (UTC)Spoilers: Supernatural through 3.12, SCC season finale.
Rating: G
Wordcount: 839
What is it: a telephone conversation in the style of Manuel Puig.
Tagline: They say "bizarre" I say "suspicious."
I hadn't read the author commentary for 'Paper Weight' but now I have! It is good; thanks for pointing it out.
I just watched 'Low Red Moon' again (for, I guess, the fourteenth time??) after reading your comment, and that is a tricky rhythm, sure. I thought it matched well with e.g. the flashing headlights, the flickering motel lights, the tap of a pen, quirky movement to the beats; however, I fully admit to swoony reaction to Tanya Donelly and the song helping trigger my usual love for cruel demon women. I like Katie Cassidy with her smirks and snark - the latter of which I kind of missed with Genevieve Cortese - despite the melodramatic, over-acted edge SPN makes all its demons put on. I found Cortese kind of bland, but then I also liked the plot choices for Ruby in S4 even less than in S3. On the other hand, Cortese has nice biceps? (Incidentally, I tried the Melrose Place remake for Cassidy and Stephanie Jacobsen, my beloved Jesse from SCC... I gave up on MP due to embarrassment squick, but I did sort of enjoy Cassidy's character before the stupid factor got too high for all the cast's characters. I am old enough to remember watching the original show, though not very clearly! I have also been watching FlashForward, which I have to say is incredibly mediocre and the only reason I continue with it is John Cho, who has the winning combination of best acting in the FF cast and least stupid writing for his character. Cortese has a recurring role on the show as an alcoholic amputee vet, hiding from a military contractor company that wants her dead due to something she witnessed in Iraq. Unfortunately, I find the delivery of her lines really unconvincing and even less suited to this role.)
A tangent (that isn't really a tangent at all) - here's another story by the same author, 'Cold Case.' (http://vee-fic.livejournal.com/40697.html) Thoroughly gen. Smart, sharp, funny, chilling; sadder, more compassionate and thoughtful - but also, oddly enough, more hopeful in important ways - than the show. Excerpt: The way their bodies overlap in the narrow bed, the cold space of her and the fabric of her clothing against his bare skin, and he can't help but pick up the shakes from her.
Rating: PG for disturbingness
Spoilers: AHBL2
Wordcount: about 7200
What is it: The woman Dean Winchester sleeps with every night.
Tagline: There is no woman.
Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-04 07:15 am (UTC)And also, I know
Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-07 02:42 am (UTC)Actually, the vidder for "Low Red Moon" did exceptionally well for the song, and there are certainly bits I like: I agree that the way she ties all those objects and symbols together is deeply fabulous - the different lights especially - and the vocal dip/movement of the kiss at 1:10 made me squeal, because it underscored how carnal and desperate and wrong that particular clip was. Though I do think there's some problems with the match-up at points - while she cuts on the beat, it's sometimes on the de-emphasized one, not the natural place, and in another piece it might work but not with this music, with the beats so clearly pronounced (at times, at least) - I was more talking about tonality and speed. She cuts fast at the fast bits, but the cuts are too static too often - face-shots or people standing or whatever. (Of course, this may be for lack of footage, but it still kind of throws me off, and maybe I'm just spoiled, but I think that little footage can still be done well. Like, at the time of "Fall of Man*" was made, there wasn't a lot of Castiel, but they still managed to make it absolutely rollocking.) But I shall wait and see the remastered version, yes? It's always fun to compare edits.
Cortese was a little bit bland, yes, though I prefer bland (which I can always pretend is subtle) to overacting. Tomato toma-to, I suppose. And it helped that she reminded me of Rachel on Glee. What attitude she didn't have, I superimposed!
"Cold Case" is exactly why I maintain that the Winchester side should summon the Witnesses next time. Kickass (and wrathful) force for good! And what a creepy story. I enjoyed the build-up of suspense.
And, um, Melrose Place? Really?
...Really?
*Probably one of my favorite vids in terms of visuals, connections, and symbolism, even though I hate the music.
Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-07 02:48 am (UTC)Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-07 02:49 am (UTC)Re: Ha-ha! It took me FOREVER to get back to you but I did it and now I will go back to work on essa
Date: 2010-01-07 02:57 am (UTC)strong arms for a skinny girl
Date: 2010-01-07 04:55 pm (UTC)I can see what you mean about static cuts - I really enjoyed them in the final sequence, though, so that may just be my thing.
Now that I think of it, I will have to say: the beginning of "Fall of Man" sucks as well! At least, I think so. But about a minute or so in it gets deeply fantastic.
Agreed on all of this! (I don't like the Matthew Good Band either.)
I enjoyed the creeptastic atmosphere of "Sea Lion"! And I like Sage Francis too. lithiumdoll is a friend, so the video was easy to find. mithborien's "Goodnight, Demon Slayer" kind of threw me off with the associations the title brought up for me - SPN is really reactionary/conservative when you compare it with Buffy the Vampire Slayer (I mean, Buffy is probably my oldest fandom, despite my much-embattled feelings about it) which makes me doubly sad with respect to how BtVS came before SPN - and then aside from that, I did enjoy the Voltaire song, but some of the lyric matches seemed strange, like "dragons to ride" when Mary's burning on the ceiling.
I am not a Glee fan, so unfortunately that wouldn't work for me! You know, I was pretty excited when I heard Cortese would be on FlashForward in such a different role - I thought maybe this time she'd have one that played to strengths as an actor she didn't get to show on SPN. I still have hope, though! She's only been in four episodes so far, though I wonder if the show's going to be cancelled before she gets much more airtime.
Yeah, the Witnesses deserve something better than ignore&vanquish. The Winchesters would be right to be wary of trying themselves to summon the Witnesses, though - if I'm not wrong, forcing the ghosts to rise made them exist in terrible pain, and also their grudges against the Winchesters (and I assume other hunters) are justified, to a greater or lesser extent. Raising angry forces the hunters can't control - and do they have the right to control summoned ghosts, anyway? I'm thinking that's a bad-guy thing, as established in that episode - and who may not be interested in listening to the Winchesters explain why they should gang up on demons instead, sounds like a recipe for Even More, Possibly Fatal Disaster.
I watched the original MP and 90210 with my sister when I was about thirteen; it was the kind of thing we did. (I read the books on her school reading lists, watched the TV shows she was probably watching because other kids at her school were watching those shows, etc.) The pre- Heather Locklear MP, as
I have been looking, in a desultory way, for Teyla vid recs! Spurred by my discovery that
Re: strong arms for a skinny girl [part one of two!]
Date: 2010-01-09 04:40 am (UTC)I always interpreted the "dragons to ride" part as negative rather than positive - the dragons to ride being monsters that must be conquered.
On second thought, I agree with your idea about the Witnesses, especially the bit about not having the right to raise them, and thus, you know, put them in a state of such terrible pain and rage that they would do things that they would (probably) not want to in a cooler state. That their grudges are justified (at least beyond the "you should have tried harder / tried at all")? I'd be wary of laying down that one, just because while, yes, the end result is the same - there were many people that the Winchesters have gotten killed over the years - the actions they took that caused this, and the rationale that informed the actions, varied a great deal. Some people, they were trying to protect. Some people, they just didn't figure it out in time, or the choice was taken away from them (the demons Ruby killed), or they were literally in a them-or-me position (the host of Azazel's "son"). Because they're human, I assume this extends to the ghosts of pretty much all the hunters, but I don't know about them to talk, so I'll just focus on the Winchester ghosts. Of the three that rose, one of them - Henrickson - was both killed and involved in the supernatural through no fault of their own. They were the reason for his death, yes, but they didn't choose to have him investigate them and thus get himself (Henrickson) in a dangerous situation; that was the FBI and Henrickson himself. Likewise, they weren't responsible for the demon getting out - the deputy was - or for Lillith killing him, and I can think of no conceivable action they would have taken that would have prevented the latter, other than the "sacrifice the virgin" plan, which a) had no guarantee that would have worked, anyway, and b) doesn't seem like something Henrickson would have allowed anyway.
As far as Ronald, the vehicle of his death is similarly not their fault. The fact that he's embroiled in the situation, however, is both his own fault (he was not forced to take an AK-47 and hold up a bank) and the Winchester's, because they didn't tell him, but one could argue that, while there might have been some other motivations at work, the more overriding one was that they were trying to protect him. Winchester Logic: He's not trained for this work, and would only be put in danger were he to involve himself in it. Therefore, what good would it do for him to know the truth? It's not going to bring him any salve, only more pain. (As Sam - and later, Dean - says in ...Children Are Our Future, "I wish Dad hadn't told us about [the supernatural]." It's obvious that, in their heart of hearts, both brothers think that, given a choice, being blissfully ignorant of the supernatural is better than being aware and either helpless or a Hunter.) So, yes, they made a mistake, but there's such a mess of good intentions and unknown variables here that it's impossible to say there could have been a right choice. Even if they told him, it's obvious they weren't going to let him on the hunt, and so Ronald very well might have ended up in the same situation, minus the "mandroid".
As for Meg... Did the brothers even know that demons could exist in a person before she took the dive off the roof? (I believe the first time it was mentioned was in Born Under a Bad Sign.)
Re: strong arms for a skinny girl [part two of two!]
Date: 2010-01-09 04:42 am (UTC)(As you can see, I am rapidly becoming fascinated with Castiel, for a great number of reasons, several of them theological, which I promise I will expand upon greatly in this fic I am writing if I ever yet it done. Yeesh. Sometimes I hate writing.)
Re: strong arms for a skinny girl [part two of two!]
Date: 2010-01-09 05:38 am (UTC)Re: strong arms for a skinny girl [part one of two!]
Date: 2010-01-09 11:47 am (UTC)Winchester Logic: He's not trained for this work, and would only be put in danger were he to involve himself in it. Therefore, what good would it do for him to know the truth? It's not going to bring him any salve, only more pain. (As Sam - and later, Dean - says in ...Children Are Our Future, "I wish Dad hadn't told us about [the supernatural]." It's obvious that, in their heart of hearts, both brothers think that, given a choice, being blissfully ignorant of the supernatural is better than being aware and either helpless or a Hunter.)
What you say about Meg is true. And as far as I can tell your assessment above is accurate! Yet the latter is wrongheaded on their (the show's zeitgeist's?) part, in that it's not like there are only two options out there. We've seen roles in the hunting community that don't directly involve combat, though granted we have seen noncombatant members of the community come to grief, one way or another. But that is somewhat different at least in definition than being a helpless victim, even if in practice the result is often the same on the show.
I had "32" and "A Charming Man" bookmarked - thank you for reminding me to download them when I have more hard drive space! Especially "A Charming Man," because as I recall giandujakiss (whom I respect a lot) posted pre-release that it was in the spirit of the song, which is about a semi-repentant serial killer. And thanks for reccing "Above and Below"; it seems like something I'll enjoy.
"Lost at Sea" has been one of my five favorite SCC videos since it was released! I love it and
*As I recall most of the comments to the post are worth reading, but I haven't tried rereading them other than the top-level comments because of how depressing it feels to consider what commenters said then, even or especially in light of what's been on the show since. (I heartily recommend
Re: strong arms for a skinny girl [part one of two!]
Date: 2010-01-09 11:57 am (UTC)But I'm a little glowing friend / But really I'm not actually your friend
Date: 2010-01-09 03:27 pm (UTC)more thoughts (minus spoilers)
Date: 2010-01-10 02:36 am (UTC)it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-10 05:41 pm (UTC)I'm not familiar with Buffy, so it's hard for me to make judgments, but as far as Supernatural goes, I can see what you mean, the Otherness especially, which is consistently disappointing. The closest they've gotten to refuting this was their angel allies - Castiel and Anna - but even then, that was annoying, because the "good" angels were the most human-like... assimilated, if you will. They need non-human allies, damn it, and they really need to find some Othered beings that aren't evil. Shapeshifters, for instance, or ghouls, since they seem to be Othered beings that don't have anything inherently "dangerous" about them - the ones that are dangerous are so because of what non-Othered humans have done to them - and move from there.
As for women in Supernatural... AAAAAAAAH. CANNOT COMPUTE MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF FAIL. And, yes, I am completely ignoring Ellen and Jo's deaths. While I am happy that we did eventually get female hunters - and black ones, too! In the same episode! And neither of them died or went evil! - I really liked them! And now they're dead, for no reason. (!!!) Like, I agree with
Not to put too fine a point on it / Say I'm the only bee in your bonnet
Date: 2010-01-11 06:20 am (UTC)Yes to all this! I imagine a video in which Castiel being endearing flashes back and forward to Castiel being creepy and/or a ruthless fucker. John Linnell's weird nasal voice probably helps contribute to the unsettling atmosphere in this imaginary vid.
(When I was in high school, They Might Be Giants was the first band I really loved - to this day, I own more albums and singles by them than by any other band. I haven't kept up with their more recent releases, but my friends and I went to their concerts, sometimes fifteen or twenty of us at once. It was pretty awesome, even if TMBG has always been totally geek rock. But I love their goofy and upbeat aesthetic, with those frequent notes of the surreal/disquieting.)
"Above and Below" made me want to watch "A Charming Man" again, so I did. (I think I just don't have the capacity to appreciate longish stretches of Dean and Sam's emo faces.) I liked "A Charming Man"; as you predicted, it incorporated exactly the type of editing and musical accompaniment I enjoy. Also it encapsulates a vision of Castiel as he would be if the character were significantly more of a mastermind, and more efficient, than he's written - quasi-repentant serial killer is about right for this. It's not a bad pairing with "Low Red Moon."
Now - and as usual, whenever I think about it - I miss Anna. I want more for her character than post-discipline Castiel having the angel police arrest her, presumably to be followed by her reprogramming/imprisonment/torture/execution, aaaaargh. Yet I'm simultaneously afraid to want more, because right now I can imagine she gave her guards the slip, whereas if we see Anna again I fear the show will pull an Ellen&Jo on us. I really like[d] Ellen and Jo. (I like Rufus too. Why bring the Harvelle women back only to kill them??? [Rhetorical question. I know the answer, and there's the usual rage again.] Non-rhetorical question: Have we ever seen a daughter avenging, or attempting to avenge her mother on SPN?)
I think the writers mostly just don't understand how to think or write about Otherness, and I honestly wouldn't hold onto much hope that they'll figure it out. See 'It's not murder, it's a metaphor,' (http://coffeeandink.dreamwidth.org/331964.html?mode=reply&style=mine) re: the almost total failure of SPN to understand how to conceptualize or allegorize racism, which opens with a quote of Eric Kripke congratulating himself on how 'Bloodlust' supposedly explores racism.
Re: it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-11 06:28 am (UTC)*Pretty sure that draft became 'It's not murder, it's a metaphor,' which was posted a couple of months later.
Re: it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-11 08:20 am (UTC)Re: it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-14 10:21 pm (UTC)This is something I've been thinking a lot about lately - power and powerlessness in regards to change - and I am not happy with the conclusions I am reaching.
Three semi-related things: No, I don't think we've ever had a daughter avenging her mother, and that's a sad thing. You could probably argue that Jo was sort of trying to avenge her father in her drive to hunt, and Tamara was avenging her daughter (?), but we've never had a female mirror to the Winchester boys. (One of the reasons why high up on my list of Episodes I Really, Really Want But Will Never Ever Get is the Winchester's encounter with an alternate universe with a genderswapped Dean.) Secondly, lynching? And thirdly - I have no idea if this is relevant or not, but it was Drano Tamara's husband was forced to drink, not gasoline. That's why it burned his mouth and throat (quite loudly and visibly, actually *shudders*).
Re: it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-23 05:37 pm (UTC)I was thinking of Jo and Tamara too, but yes, it's pretty clear there are no Winchester equivalents. Re: lynching - you are right about the drain cleaner. So, a black man is killed by being forced to drink Drano, while surrounded by white people. I... my reaction to that was the same as Betty's: Jesus on ROLLER SKATES. This could not present more like a lynching without a piece of rope present.
One of the reasons why high up on my list of Episodes I Really, Really Want But Will Never Ever Get is the Winchester's encounter with an alternate universe with a genderswapped Dean.
Re: it's a simple message and I'm leaving out the whistles and bells
Date: 2010-01-23 05:39 pm (UTC)I would too, except that TV AUs are pretty much invariably revealed to be inferior to the show's universe of reference, so if they ever did have an AU genderswapped Dean, I'm thinking we'd see her cocky attitude or some other personality trait in common with "our" Dean would get her into serious trouble - probably fatally within the episode, and it would be meant to be a Lesson for "our" Dean and/or Sam. I guess I just feel like SPN has no problem with carving stuff for the intended edification of its main protagonists on the bodies of women and black men and queer people. (I fired up "Sex and Violence" the other day because I thought the levels of fail were lower for that episode, which was ironically true given that it was the evil stripper episode, but on the other hand the siren's shapeshifting meant that the element of queerness in the text was basically inextricably linked to Evil. Well, other than an unhealthy, uncommunicative attachment to your brother, but I guess the homoerotic subtext really got away from the writers there, bwah!)
Crap, messed up HTML! Reposted!
Date: 2010-01-04 02:54 am (UTC)(skip (#skip.coldcase)) In my head, every story is Spartacus. (Not really, but close.) The only way this fictional universe works is if there's a check on evil; and unless we get Gabriel a-girt with flaming swords, it's got to be an uprising of the ordinary that does it.*
... I've had her in the back of my head, wondering what she was like as a person, because what Dean says is true: we never met her as a person, not till that very last second, when she knew she was dying and spent her last breath saving someone else.
If the show can't mourn her, or learn from her, at least I can.
... I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who was bugged by the fact that she was "a person in there" and yet, the crime against her was never particularly explored.
And now, Kripke may totally steal my idea and totally go make a season-long arc about how all the wronged ex-possessed rise up and beat the everliving crap outta their possessors. I give him leave.
... She ought to haunt them: they accidentally killed an innocent; she was the first to introduce them to the demons that are now their bread and butter; but she doesn't.
So I let her do that.
*This was written way before the introduction of the angels, but I (ticketsonmyself) think it still holds; after all, none of the ones we've seen except the fallen angels have actually cared about human people as people and about preserving human agency for individuals and for humans at large. And while we're on-a-tangent-but-not-really, whenever I think of a show's huge failure to achieve its potential re: the power of collective action, I think of the end of Heroes S1, where a couple of rich white guys - Adrian Pasdar is a POC, but obviously Nathan isn't - end up being the ones to SAAAAVE THE WORLD, while someone like Niki gets in one good hit but is told to get back because her family needs her. And the mess that follows with Niki's characterization, the incredibly problematic ways in the show frames and later portrays D.L.'s death, and a whole slew of things related to the show's portrayal of gender, race, and class for other characters as well - I feel like it all ultimately stems from that theme as depicted in the S1 finale. Sigh.
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